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  1. Senior Member
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    #26
    Interesting that OP thinks the type of computer someone has dictates their earning potential. I’m not really a fan of Microsoft, but as others have said you get more bang for your buck and it’s easier to upgrade and repair non-mac computers. I’ve read quite a few articles online about how the new mac books aren’t really cutting edge and are to the point where they are just overpriced. I’ve had an iPhone since the original one(not the 3G one, the one before it) and I’m not terribly impressed with the software releases. It seems like they are getting buggier and buggier. If that’s any indication of Apple as a whole, then I’m staying far away from mac books. Besides I need all the money I can get for the increased prices of Cisco exam fees...
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    #27
    As everyone already said it comes down to personality and use cases.


    I use a mac as I do a lot of development work these days and when I first got my mac years ago dev environments weren't' as good on windows as they are now.

    My first mac purchased in 2008 still works, and it runs really good. My wife still uses it to this day. I have a 2014 MBP and its still a very capable machiene and it has made me lots of money.

    I love the minimalness, but yet still the ability to get everything I need done.

    WIth that said I wish it had better integration with Android. I love my Galaxy phones and I cant' see myself getting an IPHONE.


    Each person uses what they use for reasons they see fit.
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  4. Completely Clueless TechGromit's Avatar
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    #28
    Funny you should ask this, I have a company issued MAC. I played around with it a little, but the interface is alien to me and I'm clueless when it comes to looking under the hood (making changes to registry, security, etc on the command line). It sits in one of my desk drawer. I use a Windows 7 laptop with VM for analyzing malware instead.
    Last edited by TechGromit; 11-18-2017 at 05:40 PM.
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  5. Senior Member boxerboy1168's Avatar
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    #29
    #1 reason to not get a mac

    cost
    Currently enrolling into WGU's IT - Security Program. Working on LPIC (1,2,3) and CCNA (and S) as long term goals and preparing for the Security+ and A+ as short term goals.
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  6. Are we having fun yet? UnixGuy's Avatar
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    #30
    Click on this link.


    5 ways to improve your MAC Speed ===> Computer Vendors Hate them!!!!!


    jokes aside, I moved from Ubuntu/Linux to Mac few years ago and life has been fantastic. Worth every penny.
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  7. Senior Member Moon Child's Avatar
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    #31
    Quote Originally Posted by DexterPark View Post
    This can start some arguments, but whatever, let's be real. I've been a Windows user for a while, heck, I've even worked for Microsoft! Not only would I recommend avoiding the company, I would strongly suggest avoiding the products!

    Look, a Mac is basically a usable form of Linux. It has a UI that doesn't suck, and all the built in network engineering tools you could ever need! And god forbid you learn automation and bump your salary by 30%, what platform do you see most Ansible, Python, Javascript, Puppet, chef users, etc?

    1) Putty? You mean terminal, ssh x.x.x.x -l username
    2) Windows/Android = ~100k /yr
    3) It works. Like, at a high level. (If you see someone trying to run Docker on Win10...RUN!)
    4) brew install...pip install....parallel....What else do you need?
    5) Dota, Stellaris, XCOM, all work on Mac. Steam works on Mac. Why are you on WinBLOWS?

    It used to be the old stereotype that only idiots had Macs, now it's the best in class IT professionals (Not all, BUT MOST!). Apple does $230 billion in revenue, Microsoft does $90 and has been around the exact same amount of time. Numbers don't lie.7
    I love Mac's. I have repaired laptop Mac's at work as a laptop tech, got my Mac Certified Associate Certificate from Apple- Mac Integration Basics. I love the Mac's. Bought a used Mac i5 off of eBay for like $200 close to a year ago. I love them.

    I love the interface better on the Mac. Seems more reliable then windows. All kinds of problems had with Windows, Neve any problem with my Mac laptop and I never had problems with my Mac mini I had years ago.

    Most IT guys I work with at work prefer Windows, more intuitive can play more games on them. I prefer the Mac's though. It is more just how they work... the overall look and interface of them I just like better than windows.

    My first IT job I did doing PHP/ apprenticeship one of the partners of the company had a MacBook that he loved.
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  8. Roaming teh Bytes OfWolfAndMan's Avatar
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    #32
    I've had a Mac and surface pro. IMO if Visio was available on Mac, I probably wouldn't care about Windows. Just about any other program I need is on Mac. The Surface Pro is overpriced. Don't get me wrong, the Mac is overpriced, but the Surface 1. Has problems with NIC chipset, as well as too much sensitivity to the touch screen (Blotches appears if you use it too "roughly". Relative to someone who is paranoid of putting a piece of tech in their bag with a couple other flat items, worrying it'll break if they put it in there. Just my experience).

    In my experience, any PC vendor outside of Apple are overly selfish with how they approach warranty issues. Apple is probably the fairest I've worked with.

    Windows works ok. a Linux VM on a PC is OK, but there are display limitations. You can still run a VM in Linux too. You can do nearly everything you want to do in Windows on Mac and more.

    -Mac has support for Ansible. Windows does not. (Yes, there is support on Docker, but Docker is not Windows).
    -Windows has bash support, but it's still not true bash. Cygwin still wins that battle IMO.
    -Windows seems slower as a dev environment (Programming languages outside of those written for Windows) relative to Mac. Just my experience. Hardware differences not being a factor.

    If we're talking about games though, yes. Windows wins. Hands down. If I want to play games, no questions. There's no reason to use a Mac when you can have nearly every game you have on a Mac on Windows, and many more past that.

    Also, if I had to choose windows, I would usually only choose Dell XPS or Lenovo Thinkpads. Laptop hardware specifically, in the past, my laptops didn't last more than a couple years. I've had my mac since the end of 2014, and it's still running strong.
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  9. Darth Lord of the Sith ITSpectre's Avatar
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    #33
    MacBooks cannot play steam games.... correct me if im wrong....

    Mac's cannot be built or customized the way I want it to be....

    Mac's are very overpriced and a PC can outpower a Mac anyday....
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  10. Senior Member kMastaFlash's Avatar
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    #34
    Wait, what's Apple?! I have Granny Smith and Gala!! hahaha
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  11. ABL - Always Be Labbin' Iristheangel's Avatar
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    #35
    Quote Originally Posted by OfWolfAndMan View Post
    I've had a Mac and surface pro. IMO if Visio was available on Mac, I probably wouldn't care about Windows. Just about any other program I need is on Mac. The Surface Pro is overpriced. Don't get me wrong, the Mac is overpriced, but the Surface 1. Has problems with NIC chipset, as well as too much sensitivity to the touch screen (Blotches appears if you use it too "roughly". Relative to someone who is paranoid of putting a piece of tech in their bag with a couple other flat items, worrying it'll break if they put it in there. Just my experience).

    In my experience, any PC vendor outside of Apple are overly selfish with how they approach warranty issues. Apple is probably the fairest I've worked with.

    Windows works ok. a Linux VM on a PC is OK, but there are display limitations. You can still run a VM in Linux too. You can do nearly everything you want to do in Windows on Mac and more.

    -Mac has support for Ansible. Windows does not. (Yes, there is support on Docker, but Docker is not Windows).
    -Windows has bash support, but it's still not true bash. Cygwin still wins that battle IMO.
    -Windows seems slower as a dev environment (Programming languages outside of those written for Windows) relative to Mac. Just my experience. Hardware differences not being a factor.

    If we're talking about games though, yes. Windows wins. Hands down. If I want to play games, no questions. There's no reason to use a Mac when you can have nearly every game you have on a Mac on Windows, and many more past that.

    Also, if I had to choose windows, I would usually only choose Dell XPS or Lenovo Thinkpads. Laptop hardware specifically, in the past, my laptops didn't last more than a couple years. I've had my mac since the end of 2014, and it's still running strong.
    Pricing-wise, the Surface Pro is comparable with the Macbook Air. Definitely not spec-wise though since the Macbook Air can only go up to 8GB of RAM (Surface can go up to 16GB), HD can only go to 512GB (Surface Pro goes up to 1TB) and I think the Macbook Air is still stuck on the 7th gen i7. The Surface Pro 4 definitely did have it's quirks with the chipset with things like going to sleep but the new Surface Pro definitely doesn't have that issue. Personally, I owned a Surface Pro 4 for the last 2-3 years and didn't have a problem with the digitizer. In fact, most of my videos were done with it and I use it for report work all the time. Haven't had to deal with blotches yet so I have no idea what happened to yours that made blotches appear but that's got to be some serious rough penning:
    NoBlotches.jpg
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  12. Senior Member DoubleNNs's Avatar
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    #36
    Quote Originally Posted by NetworkingStudent View Post
    I would like to get MAC, but may they're VERY expensive. Why are they so expensive?

    Do Macs integrate well in a AD environment?
    Macs aren't that expensive compared to Windows computers w/ similar hardware. I actually got my first Macbook Air ~6 years ago because it was maybe $300 cheaper than the cheapest comparable Windows computer at the time.

    And yes, you can join a Mac to a domain.

    Quote Originally Posted by Codeman6669 View Post
    aannnnddd if you need a cable, a charger, or basically anything, its all proprietary so you gotta pay $ for it.
    Nope. The new MacBooks have moved to the standard USB-C connector.

    I've been very pro MacBooks (but anti Apple. funny huh?) for the past few years. However, lately the MacBooks have started to lag behind the industry and are lacking innovation for the price. Apple doesn't put much focus on their laptops anymore and simply focus on their phones and tablets. With the traction the current Microsoft has been creating within the Open Source community and the features they've been including in Windows 10, I might make the switch back to Windows in 2010 after staying as far away from Windows as I could for the past half decade.
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  13. Senior Member xxxkaliboyxxx's Avatar
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    #37
    Everyone here is inferior to the Arch Linux master race.
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  14. Darth Lord of the Sith ITSpectre's Avatar
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    #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Iristheangel View Post
    Pricing-wise, the Surface Pro is comparable with the Macbook Air. Definitely not spec-wise though since the Macbook Air can only go up to 8GB of RAM (Surface can go up to 16GB), HD can only go to 512GB (Surface Pro goes up to 1TB) and I think the Macbook Air is still stuck on the 7th gen i7. The Surface Pro 4 definitely did have it's quirks with the chipset with things like going to sleep but the new Surface Pro definitely doesn't have that issue. Personally, I owned a Surface Pro 4 for the last 2-3 years and didn't have a problem with the digitizer. In fact, most of my videos were done with it and I use it for report work all the time. Haven't had to deal with blotches yet so I have no idea what happened to yours that made blotches appear but that's got to be some serious rough penning:
    Attachment 8722
    Question.....

    Which would you say is better....

    Samsung Note 12.2 or Surface pro? I plan to get one for Xmas.... and im looking for capability to store on onedrive, take notes, split screen, and be able to link to a PC or hook to a external monitor
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  15. ABL - Always Be Labbin' Iristheangel's Avatar
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    #39
    Quote Originally Posted by ITSpectre View Post
    Question.....

    Which would you say is better....

    Samsung Note 12.2 or Surface pro? I plan to get one for Xmas.... and im looking for capability to store on onedrive, take notes, split screen, and be able to link to a PC or hook to a external monitor
    I think it'd be making a mistake to compare them like it's comparing like products. The Samsung Note is a tablet running Android OS and if you're JUST looking for a tablet for reading and not having full apps, then it's perfect and probably cheaper than a Surface Pro. If you want a laptop that can run full apps and dual as a tablet and you have need of that digitizer, then pay the extra money for a Surface. It really depends on what you need to use it for but they're both not similar products even though there is some overlapping function.
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    #40
    Quote Originally Posted by DexterPark View Post
    1) You've got to spend money to make money.

    2) Because they make $230 billion /yr. I am also pissed off that I have to buy the charging cable separate from the base station, but if that's the price to avoid all the trash OS's I'll buy twice!

    3) "Salting is used because most bacteria, fungi and other potentially pathogenic organisms cannot survive in a highly salty environment".

    4) Yes. MacBooks support AD integration but then again, waterboarding works on everyone.
    Yeah I don't support that ideology and I do what I can to avoid companies who do it because it encourages it.
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  17. Senior Member DoubleNNs's Avatar
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    #41
    Quote Originally Posted by OfWolfAndMan View Post
    -Mac has support for Ansible. Windows does not. (Yes, there is support on Docker, but Docker is not Windows).
    -Windows has bash support, but it's still not true bash. Cygwin still wins that battle IMO.
    -Windows seems slower as a dev environment (Programming languages outside of those written for Windows) relative to Mac. Just my experience. Hardware differences not being a factor.
    I'd say similar reasons why I wanted a MacBook as opposed to a Win 10 machine years ago. However, in 2017 none of these bullet points are correct, even tho most of the features are still technically beta.
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  18. Roaming teh Bytes OfWolfAndMan's Avatar
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    #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Iristheangel View Post
    Pricing-wise, the Surface Pro is comparable with the Macbook Air. Definitely not spec-wise though since the Macbook Air can only go up to 8GB of RAM (Surface can go up to 16GB), HD can only go to 512GB (Surface Pro goes up to 1TB) and I think the Macbook Air is still stuck on the 7th gen i7. The Surface Pro 4 definitely did have it's quirks with the chipset with things like going to sleep but the new Surface Pro definitely doesn't have that issue. Personally, I owned a Surface Pro 4 for the last 2-3 years and didn't have a problem with the digitizer. In fact, most of my videos were done with it and I use it for report work all the time. Haven't had to deal with blotches yet so I have no idea what happened to yours that made blotches appear but that's got to be some serious rough penning: Attachment 8722
    If we're including the keyboard, I'd say it's a bit more, but then again, the price of a surface has gone down a bit. The Macbook airs seem to be dissipating away since the new Macbook pros are acceptably slim for the picky user. I still have DL speed issues with my Surface unfortunately . Not as bad as it used to be, but still, there could be some room for additional improvement.
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    #43
    Quote Originally Posted by ITSpectre View Post
    MacBooks cannot play steam games.... correct me if im wrong....

    Mac's cannot be built or customized the way I want it to be....

    Mac's are very overpriced and a PC can outpower a Mac anyday....
    MACs are capable of running steam games. I play them on my personal MAC at home. I prefer MACs mainly due to my distaste of Windows. I feel that Windows are designed in a way that after about 3-5 years, they break on you, forcing you to invest in a new one. MACs tend to have a longer life span than PCs, at least in my experience. I'm just not a huge fan of Windows and their GUI anymore.
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    #44
    Quote Originally Posted by xxxkaliboyxxx View Post
    Everyone here is inferior to the Arch Linux master race.
    I used Arch as my main home OS for a couple of years. Even had Steam running on it. No desktop distro will teach you more about Linux than installing and running Arch. Sadly; I had to go back to Windows when I left the military and needed to get a real job.
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  21. ABL - Always Be Labbin' Iristheangel's Avatar
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    #45
    On an interesting note, did anyone check this out regarding Mac's High Sierra today: https://twitter.com/lemiorhan/status/935578694541770752

    Apparently root is password-free
    Last edited by Iristheangel; 11-29-2017 at 05:04 AM.
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    #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Iristheangel View Post
    On an interesting note, did anyone check this out regarding Mac's High Sierra today: https://twitter.com/lemiorhan/status/935578694541770752

    Apparently root is password-free
    That's the bonus 6th reason, you don't waste time with annoying passwords.
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  23. Network Security tpatt100's Avatar
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    #47
    I have had a Microsoft Surface and a few Macbooks/Pros over the years. The Dell laptops irritated me because back when I bought them they were trying to imitate the Macbook Pro but using cheaper parts and it got hot all the time and the fans would run really high doing anything.

    Bought a Surface Pro and never had a need to use it as a tablet and I hated the keyboard (second gen) it was a nice laptop but all the tablet apps I liked to use were better on my iPad. I like the newer Surfaces though because they improved the keyboards, unfortunately for personal use I felt no need for a personal laptop anymore and iOS app developers show greater preference for iOS probably because they make more money off iOS so the support is focused there. When Evernote dropped support for their Windows tablet app, I figured I might as well stick with an iPad for personal use.

    Apple's prices for laptops don't bother me, Microsoft's prices for their Surface machines is worth it. Microsoft knew they had to raise consumer's tolerances for higher priced/quality machines because so many competitors and the race to the bottom was putting out a lot of trashy Windows laptops with bloated third party software.

    With that, once I finished school I never had much of a need for a personal laptop anymore. My Macbook Pro sat unused for weeks at a time. Only booted it up to patch it, sync iPhotos, Evernote, OneDrive, etc.

    I sold it on eBay and used some of the money for an iPad Pro and only use my Windows 10 machine for PC gaming. My wife has a Macbook and I hop on that once in a while when I need to do something on an actual computer but now a days my "real computer" use is almost next to nothing.

    Microsoft is trying really hard with Windows 10 but it feels like its too little too late. It's got an ecosystem that I really don't have much of a need for anymore because I am not tied to the desktop like I was maybe 5+ years ago? Office is on my iPhone and iPad and I primarily have Office 365 because I got a multi year academic license for 35 dollars.... I use it for OneDrive and look at it as getting Microsoft Office for free.

    Apple is really pushing "form over function" now a days and it's finally ended my preference for Mac vs Windows, I don't care for either of them anymore. I love Mac OS but just don't have much of a need for it anymore and Windows 10's updates keeps pushing apps on to my machine that I don't want or have a need for, uninstall and next update they come back. What really pushed me over the edge were ads for OneDrive in Windows file explorer, a service I was already paying for.....

    Most online shopping now a days is done on mobile, the personal computer is "something I use at work". Microsoft missed the boat big time with mobile devices but I am glad they support iOS and Android now so I am not tied to any particular platform. I can move between Mac and Windows for personal reasons, for now on though I will only purchase Mac or Microsoft Surface machines for personal use if I find the need for a portable computer again.
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    #48
    tpatt100, very interesting viewpoint. What you're talking about is more how much wife uses a computer today, 99% on her phone, then uses a laptop if she has to write up a document, but also works in the medical field so it's a different situation. I'm assuming you work in security from your cert list, surprised you never need "a real computer" once you leave work.
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    #49
    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleNNs View Post
    I'd say similar reasons why I wanted a MacBook as opposed to a Win 10 machine years ago. However, in 2017 none of these bullet points are correct, even tho most of the features are still technically beta.
    Beta isn't exactly a "Stable" release, but I am glad they're pushing for Ansible on windows at least now .
    Reading: Lab Books, Ansible Documentation Goals: Bash Shell/Python Automation Refinement [], CCIE R&S Written [X], AWS Certified Solutions Architect Associate (Maybe) [] CCIE R&S Counter: Somewhere between zero and infinity
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  26. Senior Member DexterPark's Avatar
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    #50
    Quote Originally Posted by OfWolfAndMan View Post
    Beta isn't exactly a "Stable" release, but I am glad they're pushing for Ansible on windows at least now .
    But who needs native Windows support? You can build a Docker image of Ansible and run it from there.
    My advice to anyone looking to advance their career would be to learn DevOps tools and methodologies. Learn how to write code in languages like Python and JavaScript. Not to be a programmer, but a network automation specialist who can do the job of 10 engineers in 1/3 of the time. Create a GitHub account, download PyCharm, play with Ansible, Chef, or Puppet. Automation isn't the future, it's here today and the landscape is changing dramatically.
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